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Talk:Solidus Snake
Other Images Can we get a picture of Solidus in his exoskeleton (i.e. from in-game)? The official artwork has him in that billowing cloak, which makes it impossible to actually see his armor and weaponry. Peace Walker Does anyone agree that 1972 should be removed as Solidus' DOB? After all in Peace Walker which is set in 1974 when Kaz has that phone conversation asking about the "sons" he says "two already"...thus proving that Solidus wasnt created the same year as Solid Snake and Liquid Snake. BigBoss1292 01:08, July 25, 2010 (UTC) King Dosen't Ocelot refer to Solidus as KING during MGS2 User:Captain-One :Yes he does, but its more in reference to Dead Cell than anything else. Vamp also calls Fortune "Queen". Justin 20:53, 12 April 2008 (UTC) ::Yeah plus there's business with King, Queen, Jack (Raiden) and Ace (Snake). What I'm more curious about is why is George Sears listed under "real name"? Is there any proof either way? Chaos91 09:18, 13 April 2008 (UTC) that's true George Sears his only his public name althrough it could be his true name theres actually no evidence,plus i'm going to add KING to the Also Known As section. User:Captain-One not really that important but i thought i'd just point out that it's vamp who calls him King, not ocelot User:Soul reaper :Nope. Just ran through the script and couldn't find one instance of Vamp calling him King, and Ocelot referred to him as King on at least two occassions. --Fantomas 12:22, January 26, 2010 (UTC) status discussion hey rather than get into a revert war lets sort it out here. The accepted view is that Solidus died at the end of MGS2. It doesn't matter if you disagree with this because someone (doesn't have to be fantomas) will change it back. I think the quote is too trivial for this article as we don't know what the context of it is yet. But perhaps there are other things you could try like making an article with similar quotations. please keep contributing. :-) --Drawde83 01:28, 27 May 2008 (UTC) well said Drawde83, but in the courage is solid trailer at 1:19 Solidus' voice is heard repeatng a comment made at the conclusion of MGS2 although it could be one the flashbacks that Kojima was talking about where players can view scenes from previous games although we wont know until next month, but who knows if Vamp can come back then why not. :-) User:Captain-One :But we still saw him have his spine cut. With Vamp it's kind of a different matter. Changing the whole article to say he "could be alive" is a little crazy, man! --Fantomas 10:30, 27 May 2008 (UTC) ::so has that sorted it or does it still need changing? --Drawde83 21:24, 27 May 2008 (UTC) :::Yeah it's sorted we will just have to wait until the realese and edit accordingly. User:Captain-One incorrect info under Manhattan inciedent it says in the article beneath the Manhattan incident that (Solidus planned on using a nuclear warhead from Arsenal Gear to create a gigantic electro-magnetic-pulse over New York City, and attempt to reveal the existence of The Patriots to worldwide public scrutiny.) however as revealed in the conclusion of MGS2 Solidus actually intended to get a list of the patriots names from GW and then hand arsenal over to dead cell who would of drawn the patriots fire whilst he would then hunt the 12 men down killing them of one after another, of-corse the patriots along with Ocelot pre-scripted the entire event which basiclly redered solidus's plans usless, i'm just saying this because the site is surposed to give full acurate detailes so i think the article should be changed and if no one minds i'm going to get started on doing so. User:Captain-One Custom P90? I ran through MGS2 the other day and noticed that Solidus' P90 seemed to have explosive rounds of some kind. Note when he is attacking the RAYs; all his shots explode on their surface. Given how much damage a surface-to-air missile did to the MP RAYs, and how much damage Solidus' P90 did, he must have some sort of special armor-piercing explosive tipped rounds. Thoughts? -No, the script says he sniped out their AI cores... As infeasible as that sounds. Guess the Ray's use Goldeneyes "Explodycomputers" Age On the trivia section it says that he was 28 but when it says when he was born he was 1972 in April 29/30 during the Big Shell Incident he was 36/37 but he was a later model being born after Liquid/ Solid. Also it says 42 at death... to who ever edited that... how is that possible? If he was born in 1972 he'd be around 37 at the time of his death. Or possibly he was born after Solid/Liquid making him even younger. :OK, you want to know the reason why he was listed as having died in 2014 (ie, at 42 years old)? The reason why is because during Third Sun, Snake enters the van and sees "Big Boss's body" (actually Solidus's body). When he goes to touch it, the body suddenly stirs to life and moves a bit. If you zoom up in this scene, you'd even see the eye move. This meant that Solidus actually survived the battle with Raiden, but was in constant paralysis. It was even mentioned in the trivia section, in the part where it explained that the body had his left eye missing instead of his right, which gave eagle-eyed viewers an early clue as to it actually being Solidus's body. Anyways, hope that answer's your question. Weedle McHairybug 01:02, January 26, 2010 (UTC) Oh sorry man mistake on my part..sorry Events prior to the big shell?????? Was Solidus working with Liquid Snake during Shadow Moses? How did Ocelot end up meeting and working for Solidus? Did Solidus ever align himself with Sergei Gurlukovitch? Because Gurlukovitch seemed to know Ocelot was "in league" with him right before he was killed on the tanker. : I think a lot of these topics were left as a mystery on purpose. Therefore they don't explain them any further in any of th games and you'll have to come up with your own theories. anyway here's what I think. : no probably not. : The patriots would have arranged it. Going on the run Solidus would have found someone with CIA and Foxhound experience to be useful. He may have been familiar with Ocelots work through being president. : Ocelot probably had to convince Sergei that he was still a russian patriot (as he'd been in foxhound). While planning they may have heard that Solidus was after RAY too. When Ocelot switched sides he would have assumed that Solidus was behind it. :--Drawde83 20:20, 5 August 2009 (UTC) :: Im pretty sure in MGS2 the President says that George Sears(Soldus) sent his right hand man (Ocelot) to coax Liquid into starting the Shadow Moses rebellion. And that is why Solidus had to leave office and go on the run. So it seems that Solidus knew Ocelot before Liquid did. As president he may have pushed for Ocelot to get into Foxhound so he could coerce Liquid into rebelling. ::I'm also guessing that Ocelot may have also, at least partially, aligned himself with Solidus Snake under his own free will, seeing how Ocelot himself was also against The Patriots. I also suspect that Solidus was also involved with the Gurlukovich Mercenaries both before and after the Shadow Moses Incident, seeing how Ocelot was revealed to be working for Sergei Gurlukovich and Solidus Snake, and Solidus even has the Gurlukovich Mercenaries as part of the Sons of Liberty. Weedle McHairybug 01:52, January 20, 2010 (UTC) :: :: Was Solidus working with Liquid Snake during Shadow Moses? - He attempted to reveal the patriots through the Shadow Moses incident, but failed, losing his place as president. How did Ocelot end up meeting and working for Solidus? - He knew solidus in MGS1, as in the after credit phone calls the one who he refers to as "Mr. President" is solidus. Did Solidus ever align himself with Sergei Gurlukovitch? Because Gurlukovitch seemed to know Ocelot was "in league" with him right before he was killed on the tanker. - I do not know, but Ocelot refered to sergei in MGS1, maybe he was trying to get them working for solidus? just a thought - Dirty Duck :: Name? Why is his name Solidus Snake, instead of something that fits with Solid and Liquid, like Gas Snake or Freeform Snake. Woulda sounded stupid, but probably not as stupid as Solidus. It just sounds made-up, and not at all like a codename. --Toast 02:22, November 16, 2009 (UTC) :Okay, I just found out the term "Solidus" basically means when something is inbetween liquid and solid. Still though, he's less like Liquid and Solid Snake than he is his own person. I guess it was the best they could do, but that won't stop me from complaining about how dumb it sounds. --Toast 02:38, November 16, 2009 (UTC) ::Well, it makes sense. Liquid had all of Big Boss' "dominant genes", Solid had all of Big Boss' "recessive genes" and Solidus was a perfect clone, with a mix of dominant and recessive genes. He was literally the point between Solid and Liquid in terms of genes. --Fantomas 03:00, November 16, 2009 (UTC) :::Okay, fine, this game is perfect. It still sounds dumb though. --Toast 23:11, November 26, 2009 (UTC) :::I should also note that "Solidus" is also an archaic currency can we please stop saying he died in Metal Gear Solid 2? Ok, several times before, both on consecutive and non-consecutive occasions, there have been editors (mostly Crashsnake, but one other editor tried to do this as well) who keep on changing his date of death/age to 36 or 37 in order to imply that he died in MGS2, even though MGS4 explicitly shows his biomort moving when Snake tried to touch him, which means that he survived. I'll admit, I thought he died in MGS2, but Bluerock made some good points about his survival, especially with the part about his moving. Anyways, we really should put a halt to this. The same goes for any edits on the main biography that tries to hint that he died in the Manhattan Incident. Weedle McHairybug 02:44, January 24, 2010 (UTC) :Hmm... The only reason I can see for the disagreement was that somebody previously wrote in the article that it wasn't actually his body that moved, implying it was somehow 'animated', to go along with the whole masquerade. But this was just speculation and it was removed a while ago, so it is more probable that he was actually alive. :Also, if they can save Big Boss from being burned to a crisp, surely the Patriots can do the same for Solidus with his injuries. After all, it wasn't his spinal chord that was cut, or he would have dropped dead on the spot, rather than succumbing to his injuries over a period of time. :To anyone still in doubt, I hope this helps explain how he did actually survive, albeit in an induced (probably permanent) coma. Bluerock 03:13, January 24, 2010 (UTC) So did Solidus Snake die in MGS2 or or MGS4? CrashSnake is still reverting the edits about his death in 2014. Personally, I assume he died in 2014 because his body moved but if he or anyone of you can find a better explanation of why his body moved, please state it. 18:12, May 19, 2010 (UTC) :I'm gonna have to guess MGS4. Other than the fact that he moved when Snake tried to touch him, there's also something else that an even more important detail: The SOP system requires not only the DNA of the person to unlock, but also their Biometric data. In other words, the subject needs to also be alive instead of just using their DNA. The fact that Solidus worked just as well heavily implies that he survived the attack from Raiden. Weedle McHairybug 18:57, May 19, 2010 (UTC) ::Sorry Weedle, I may have to disagree with you on that. I don't believe all of Big Boss's biometric data was necessary to access JD. Liquid was able to (partially) access the system using Solid Snake's DNA alone, in Act 2. Therefore, Solidus didn't need to be alive for Liquid's purposes. :Originally, I was convinced that Solidus must be alive, and was in essentially the same state that Big Boss was in, before his "revival." However, now I'm not so sure, as there are a couple of things that make me doubt it. ::Firstly, it is possible that he is brain dead, so medically speaking he is actually "dead" and his body (breathing, circulation, nutrition) is merely being maintained by the life support. :Secondly, the movement of the arm may simply be random electrical impulses in the nerves, as its commonly known that dead bodies can sometimes do this. I think many people assumed it may have been a reaction to Old Snake's approach, but it was probably for cinematic value (at this point, the audience assumes it is the body of the still-living Big Boss). ::Finally, if he was indeed alive (i.e. not brain dead), its a little wierd to think they would scavenge him for parts for Big Boss, probably against his will, but then again, who knows what lengths EVA would go to to revive Big Boss. However, she did seem pretty determined to save Solidus from being shot by Ocelot. 70.127.204.44, you suggested she thought it was actually Big Boss, as her rebel group possessed both bodies at one point. But Big Boss would have looked a lot more "healed/repaired" than Solidus, if he was not already up and about at that time, and EVA would have known this. If she did believe it WAS Big Boss, then I would suggest the reason why was because of her injured/exhausted state at the time, as only a brief time earlier, she had a hallucination of Old Snake as Big Boss. ::Sorry for going on a bit, probably not a lot of help, but those are my thoughts anyway. I actually think he may have died in 2009. --Bluerock 19:06, May 19, 2010 (UTC) :::It's just that the way EVA reacted, it seemed that she thought that the body was Big Boss's. I still think she didn't know that Ocelot was faking being Liquid. Her reaction when he crushed the apple and destroyed the Pyx seemed real. Also, it wouldn't make sense for her to sacrifice ALL of her children to put on a massacre while getting Solidus's body out of the church. Anyway, I guess the official consensus is that Solidus died in 2009. The electrical pulses make sense. Also, Naomi didn't correct Snake when he said Solidus was dead but she did when he said Big Boss died. Finally, The Patriots kept telling Raiden to kill Solidus. It wouldn't make sense for them to keep him alive. -- 20:49, May 19, 2010 (UTC) Body Spasms!? "Solidus Snake lost his left eye, whereas Big Boss lost his right. The body that Big Mama showed to Solid Snake in Eastern Europe, during Liquid Ocelot’s Insurrection, was missing its left eye and had its right eye closed, giving an early clue that it was actually Solidus, rather than Big Boss. It should also be noted that even though the body moved slightly in the van as Snake approached it, the movement may simply be random electrical impulses in the nerves, as its commonly known that dead bodies can sometimes do this." OK, now this is in the article about solidus snake, but however, if he was dead since (which this is implying) 2009 then his body would not have any spasms anymore. He must of been alive at that point. And when he got beaten by raiden at federal hall, he was wearing his exoskeleton. And note that blood can be seen coming from injured gekkos, maybe it was his exo-skeletons fluids? Thoughts? - Dirty Duck :He's brain dead, but a body itself can be maintained in a "living" state, resulting in random muscle movement. The MGS4 Database implied that the body was deliberately animated in this manner, in order to pretend it was actaully Big Boss's consciousness, in a coma-like state. --Bluerock 10:53, August 28, 2010 (UTC) :Ok, now I'm confused. Is Solidus dead or brain dead? Did Raiden kill him or not? There's a BIG difference between dead and brain dead. How can dead (not brain dead) bodies move? Anyway, I've edited that paragraph. If anyone can think of a better explanation, please feel free to do so.-- 13:31, August 28, 2010 (UTC) ::If someone is brain dead, they are dead, scientifically speaking. The body may still function for a time afterwards, but the person has still passed away. An eletrical impulse within the nerves will still cause muscle movement. Therefore, Raiden did indeed kill him. --Bluerock 12:36, August 29, 2010 (UTC) :::Yeah, that did NOT answer my question at all. I meant dead like FATMAN or PSYCHO MANTIS. They are REALLY dead, not brain dead. In other words, their hearts no longer beat. Same with Patrick Swayze. He's 100% dead, not brain dead. Once again there's a difference between brain dead and dead. I don't understand why The Patriots kept him alive though. Anyway, I guess brain dead bodies can move, not 100% dead bodies.-- 14:42, August 29, 2010 (UTC) :The person is dead, though the body may still be kept alive artificially. Its not that much different to keeping a person's cells alive after they die. --Bluerock 15:15, August 29, 2010 (UTC) :Ah, now that makes sense. Thanks for the explanation. -- 15:20, August 29, 2010 (UTC) MGS1? Is there a reason why Solidus is among the list of MGS1 characters when he made his first physical appearance in SOL? Before anyone says anything, I am aware that Ocelot was heard talking to him at the end of the original but we don't hear his voice or see him at any time during the game. GOTP counts obviously because his brain dead body makes an appearance in the game but I think it would be best to remove his name from the MGS1 character list and place it in the GOTP character list instead. RDASUX 01:23, February 23, 2011 (UTC) :He was heavily involved in the events of that game, even without a physical appearance. --Bluerock 08:40, February 23, 2011 (UTC) : :Doesn't matter, he was not in the game and should not be listed as a character as it gives the wrong impression. Big Boss played an important role in the game but he did not appear either as he was presumed dead. Being mentioned and having a role in the game's plot doesn't mean they were in the game, which they wern't. RDASUX 12:12, February 23, 2011 (UTC) ::Then I suggest some definition be agreed upon on what constitutes a game's "characters." Surely all characters mentioned in the game's storyline should qualify, Big Boss included, but perhaps you're trying to make a different argument? It doesn't really give a wrong impression. --Bluerock 13:22, February 23, 2011 (UTC) :: ::I'm not trying to argue about anything. I merely stated that a character who makes no appearance in the game should not be listed as a character. Liquid is referenced throughout GOTP as it was initially believed that he had taken over Ocelot's mind but he isn't included on the list of characters who appear in said game because he isn't in it. Because a character is referenced and talked about by other characters doesn't mean they were in the game. If you were to look at the list of characters in MGS1 and both Solidus and Big Boss were included, people who haven't played the game would expect to see them and would be left confused by the absense of both characters. RDASUX 13:47, February 23, 2011 (UTC) :::I didn't imply anything negative about you arguing your case. I was trying to clarify whether your particular argument was only concerned with characters that directly interact with Snake during the game, as opposed to all the game's characters in general. Big Boss and the US President were major characters who factored into the plot of the game, so I don't see how they were not "in the game" as you say simply because they were off screen. If that were the case, Master Miller wouldn't be a character since he never "appeared." --Bluerock 19:15, February 23, 2011 (UTC) Sneaking Suit knowledge? In Metal Gear Solid 2, when discussing about an alleged FOXHOUND intruder on the Big Shell (Raiden), Revolver Ocelot mentioned something about Solidus knowing a lot more about Sneaking Suits than he himself does, so should I add it in to the trivia section? Weedle McHairybug 00:44, April 24, 2011 (UTC) :As U.S. President he was probably aware of some of the high-tech equipment used in the military. James Johnson also recognised Raiden's Skull Suit. The dialogue was probably meant to reinforce the idea that he may have been Solid Snake, since his identity had not been revealed at that point, I believe. It's not really worth mentioning. --Bluerock 11:21, April 24, 2011 (UTC) Solidus in Revengance Dude Solidus is in Metal gear rising revengance how cool is that Yes, he is quite an underrated villain. I speculate that he will appear in flash back scenes to Raiden's childhood. They'd have to pull some pretty serious shit outta their asses to bring him back from the dead... I know right solidus is probably the villian i like the most in the whole metal gear saga and i think he gets a lot less credit than he deserves Solidus deserves a bigger role than the one Kojima has given him. Here's hoping he makes a return - along with his exo-suit from MGS2 - in any of Revengeance, Ground Zeroes or "The Phantom Pain". George W Bush edits Okay, I want to make something VERY clear to you guys: There should be NO edits that claim that George W. Bush was George Sear's predecessor, as we don't know whether George W. Bush even existed in the Metal Gear series. We also don't mention Bill Clinton as a predecessor, either. Weedle McHairybug (talk) 16:43, January 18, 2013 (UTC) Liberia Why was Solidus in Liberia to begin with? Raiden claims that Solidus was a CIA paramilitary at the time, but why did CIA send him there? From what I can find neither America nor CIA were involved in the First Liberian Civil War. So why would CIA get involved? Just to test how effective Solidus is as a soldier? Erik1310 (talk) 12:34, April 12, 2014 (UTC) :In reality, the CIA always keeps an eye open. :Storywise, Solidus fits the supposed profile of a SAD/SOG officer; a deniable operator, alone in foreign territory. It's his age that's most striking though. We find that the (first) Liberian civil war began 24 Decemeber 1989 and lasted until 17 August 1996. Solidus, being born between 1972-1976, has an age of 17-13 by the time the war starts. :To become apart of the CIA, you need a bachelor's degree to even be considered. That's saying nothing of the process to become an actual SAD/SOG officer. It's all a bit much to accept realistically of a kid. :Speculation points to everything about Solidus being apart of the CIA as nothing more than lies on paper. Lies needed to muster resources from the agency as Solidus completed his assignments. His true age, family background, education, military career, etc., it would all either be a fiction in a file folder. Another possibility is that data simply never existed at all and Solidus was funded solely via black budget funds. See, however it went down, Solidus had to have been combat-trained and qualified before going into Liberia. Whoever did that did so knowing they were training a child for war. It's possible the CIA had something to do with that, and did so using their denibale options afforded to them through their paramilitary division. The benefits are obvious; actual combat experience for a clone of Big Boss on the most gruesome battlefields Africa has supposedly ever known. :19MAY2014 Where is it actually stated that Solidus was a CIA paramilitary? Is it in Rising?? There are no actual sources for the info so I'm just curious. --MOB-4-Life (talk) 22:51, May 19, 2014 (UTC) :Call Kevin Washington in R-03, shortly after receiving access to your (ex-)Maverick members' call lists. Kevin, after scolding Raiden for his recklessly going to Denver to pursue the brains, have them discuss about the Sears Program's connection to Liberia. Raiden will then stated that Solidus had been CIA Paramilitary. You can look up the conversation on the Revengeance radio conversations article on the wiki, as it's on there. And yes, it is in Rising. Weedle McHairybug (talk) 22:54, May 19, 2014 (UTC) ::I never played the game so thanks for clearing that up. As far as the reasoning behind Solidus being in Liberia goes, the US government were supporters of the Presidency of Samuel Doe who held power in Liberia at the beginning of the first civil war before being murdered in 1990. Therefore its not out of the question that the CIA would have some personnel there to feed information to Doe and then aid the opposition forces to those who saught to replace him after his death. --MOB-4-Life (talk) 20:20, May 20, 2014 (UTC) Sears It's crystal clear that Solidus has been the US President as George Sears, and it seems likely his real name is George. But "Sears"? For his public image was his last ame, but neither of them (him, BB, Solid, Liquid etc.) have ever revealed their last name. To me sounds more likely that he came up with his last name for presidency. If so, shouldn't be listed as "real name George" and that's it, perhaps may moving "George Sears" to his aliases? The 2nd travel of the Titanic (talk) 12:35, October 30, 2015 (UTC) :Well, being President obviously requires that his last name be disclosed. Kojima didn't feel it was necessary to disclose the last name of the other Snakes but they obviously have it. -- 13:30, October 30, 2015 (UTC) ::I think the "real name" is being used to represent his civilian name here, as I don't believe there's any evidence that he was born as "George (Sears)" (similar to "Frank Jaeger" for Gray Fox). --Bluerock (talk) 13:36, October 30, 2015 (UTC) :::So Solidus doesn't have a real name? -- 13:50, October 30, 2015 (UTC) ::::Not necessarily, just depends what you mean by "real." There's no reason to assume he was born under that name. Perhaps the infobox could be modified, so that the "real name" parameter isn't confused with birth name? --Bluerock (talk) 14:17, October 30, 2015 (UTC) ::::Yes, that's exactuy what I meant. He's publicly known as "George Sears", but unlike the name which can be assumed to be the real one, the last name is total fiction (either by him or the Patriots' AIs). For these reasons, I was wondering if "George Sears" should be in the aliases section, rather than be put as the real name (which could may be just George, much like Solid is David and Liquid is Eli). The 2nd travel of the Titanic (talk) 16:46, October 30, 2015 (UTC) When was Solidus born? The Phantom Pain timeline for 1972 doesn't mention Solidus and Zero only mentions two sons when talking to Miller. Being born in 1976 is possible but I doubt the CIA would use a 13 year old as a paramilitary.-- 13:48, October 30, 2015 (UTC) :The only Kojima Game source for his birth year, IIRC, is in MGS3's end timeline ("Sons of Big Boss"). Him being a CIA paramilitary is an invention of Revengeance; prior to that, he was just a commander of child soldiers (though not necessarily one himself). --Bluerock (talk) 14:17, October 30, 2015 (UTC) :Solidus' birth is a topic that I've always been vey interested in. Any source I can remember pretty much says he's the youngest, since was created after Solid and Liquid (and without using neither EVA or Clark's assistant's help), but could may imply was still in the same year. However, Solidus is te only one never mentioned in the prequels (bothSolid and Liquid are often mentioned in TPP and once in PW; jee, Liquid even makes a -pretty disappointing, but still- appearance), Ocelot in the Truth tapes sounds like not even knowing about Solidus (but that could be just my impression, as much as the story Cipher/Patriots on the other talk page). The project is known to have been abandoned and shut down in 1976 (is mentioned in the ending timeline of PW and GZ, if I recall), but to me nothing seems to suggest that he was actually born in 1972 itself; or maybe yes? It's pretty ambiguous, coul be any time between 1972 (after the twins) and 1976. The 2nd travel of the Titanic (talk) 17:01, October 30, 2015 (UTC)